«Parents need to learn to assert themselves when it comes to mobile phones.»

Mr Wolff, my daughter received her first mobile phone for her 12th birthday. What is the most important rule we should set for her?

In the evening and especially at night, the phone needs to be removed from your daughter's bedroom so that she can sleep undisturbed. But you've already come a long way if she doesn't get her own smartphone until she's 12.

You have been giving workshops as a digital trainer at German schools with pupils, teachers and parents for eight years. What is your experience there?

It is difficult to generalise, but two things stand out: the age at which children get their first mobile phone is getting lower and lower, and many parents do not pay enough attention to what their children are doing with these small computers.

The children tell me about scenes from horror films, pornography and cybergrooming.

When do children usually get their first mobile phone?

The typical reason is the transition to secondary school, which in Germany usually takes place after the fourth grade. Since the coronavirus pandemic, however, many primary school children already have a smartphone and use WhatsApp, TikTok, Instagram, YouTube and other platforms, sometimes without any restrictions.

Why is this early access so problematic?

Because children encounter things online that overwhelm, disturb or sometimes even traumatise them. During my school visits, children tell me about scenes from horror films, pornography or even cybergrooming, which is when paedophiles try to make contact with children online. I have been in primary school classes where an execution by an Islamist terrorist group was shared in a WhatsApp group, or an incredibly gruesome scene from the war in Ukraine.

Often, children do not see terrible things intentionally, but only because an app's recommendation algorithm wants to attract more attention – so that children use the platform longer and advertising revenue increases. When a 14-year-old is confronted with these things, it is certainly not good and can leave its mark – but at this age, they may be better able to understand and process such things than a primary school child.

How do you get the children to tell you all that?

First, I show them that I have almost all of the social media apps and games that are popular among children installed on my own mobile phone. Immediately, I hear comments such as, «Wow, you have TikTok?», «Really, Brawl Stars?» or «Did you install all of that yourself?»

Then I say: «Yes, I use and play all of these things myself, and I will answer all of your questions about them in a moment. But first, I have a few questions for you. It is very important to note that I am not a teacher or a police officer – I don't even know your names. You can be completely honest today and say absolutely anything – even things your parents don't know, because that's when it gets really exciting. So, once again: absolutely nothing will be punished today !» All teachers present must then promise solemnly that they will forget everything that happens in this workshop, which they are usually happy to do.

And does it work?

Definitely. Children regularly tell me how many WhatsApp messages they actually receive at night, what terrible videos they have seen or how many hours they spend playing on their mobile phones every day – and at night. Parents usually have no idea about this.

40 percent of parents allow 8- to 9-year-olds to take their mobile phones to bed with them. In my opinion, this is the biggest mistake they can make.

Which brings us to the parents.

It makes a big difference whether, as a parent, I talk to my child about the most important dangers before handing them a smartphone, regulate access to certain apps, introduce media usage times, i.e. closely monitor media consumption, or whether I simply hand my child a device and then don't bother about it any further.

And do parents do the latter?

Unfortunately, in my experience, very many. Most mothers and fathers are not yet able to recognise the complexity of this device. A smartphone changes its character with every app, becoming a completely new device. There are apps that are really dangerous for children because paedophiles use them to make contact with children and young people, such as the video app OmeTV or the TikTok copy Likee. Likee even shares location data. This means that if I make a video at home, strangers will know where I live after I post it. Many children are familiar with these apps, but their parents usually are not.

I would argue that many parents do care about what their children see and experience online. But it is incredibly challenging to keep track of everything.

Definitely, I agree with you. Media education is very demanding, but it is one of the most important educational tasks in the digital age. What we need to realise is that today's generation of parents only acquired this device with all its functions as adults – and therefore use it accordingly. Adults primarily use WhatsApp to exchange information. Is that a problem? Not usually! So they don't see any problem in allowing their children to use WhatsApp.

Children want to have fun above all else.

Exactly. And that's around the clock. When I ask the young participants in my workshops, «How many messages have you received on WhatsApp in one night?», third graders typically answer «60», fifth graders «1200» and some seventh graders «6000».

Even though most of the messages are funny pictures and emojis, every school has class chats with thousands of messages every night. Studies show that 40% of parents allow their 8- to 9-year-olds to take their mobile phones to bed with them. The older the children get, the higher this percentage rises, with more than half of all young people in Germany falling into this category. The situation is likely to be similar in Switzerland.

At that moment, however, parents certainly do not assume that their child is hanging out on WhatsApp or TikTok at night.

But many people do. Because the temptation is so great – and because they are children. In my opinion, the biggest mistake parents can make is to let their child take a smartphone to bed with them. If you do that, you lose the opportunity to accompany your child. You have no idea what they are doing. And certainly not how long they are doing it for.

When asked about this, they say that the mobile phone is in flight mode and is being used as an alarm clock.

Of course. Because that's how most parents handle their own devices. Which, incidentally, is a good reason to get an alarm clock and set a good example. Once again : children use smartphones differently than adults. What would you have done when you were young? Imagine you had a little box that you could use to have fun with your best friends day and night.

When parents take away their child's smartphone because of content they don't want them to see, the child learns that they cannot trust them. But trust is the most important thing.

When I ask a workshop group who has ever stayed up all night on their smartphone and gone to school the next morning, several children in every class raise their hands, sometimes even 9- and 10-year-olds. Many children set their phones to silent and dim the screen so that their parents don't notice, even if they come into their room unexpectedly.

The numerous emojis are certainly among the more innocuous content they encounter during this time.

Exactly. According to many accounts from children and young people, the internet often becomes even harsher, worse and more cruel at night. My guess is that the algorithms play harder stuff to keep young users hooked – and prevent them from falling asleep, which would mean a loss of advertising revenue.

Here's a concrete example: Have you heard of "Terrifier»? It's a terribly brutal American horror film that's very popular among schoolchildren right now. Or infamous. Imagine a 10-year-old is on TikTok at night under the covers, and suddenly a young influencer appears and says, «Look, I'm at the cinema right now. It's totally crazy! The film is so awful! Oh my God, don't watch this film!» And then in the comments below, someone writes: «Do you know the terrible yoga scene? Please don't watch it!» And they add a YouTube link that takes you straight to that scene. What does the curious 10-year-old do?

He clicks on the link.

And very quickly becomes completely shocked. He reflexively closes the video and thinks: «Oh God, no, what did I just watch? I should never have clicked on that. That's awful. If my parents find out, my smartphone will be gone!»

So what does this mean for parents?

Parents should never take away their child's smartphone because of content they have seen. This is another very important rule. If they do, their child will learn that they cannot trust them. The harshest punishment in the digital age is banning a smartphone. A smartphone is a device where children alone decide what their parents see, and no one else. That is why we as parents must do everything we can to ensure that our children trust us.

Therefore, one crucial thing parents should say to their children is: «You can always come to me with anything you encounter on the internet, and I will never take your smartphone away from you because of it.» When asked about the best age for a child to get their first mobile phone, I often respond with a counter-question: «When do you think your child will be ready to encounter something as terrible as «Terrifier» online?»

But it's not that simple. I can't say that my 12-year-old daughter isn't ready for such content, so she won't get her own mobile phone until she's 16 or 18. That's unrealistic. There has to be a middle ground.

Of course there is, in the sense of close and vigilant supervision. We have already discussed two important aspects in this regard: no smartphones in the bedroom at night and no mobile phone ban as a punishment if disturbing content appears. For younger children, i.e. up to the age of 13, child protection software and time limits are also necessary.

Parents and children should discuss mobile phone use together and establish rules.

Then, every time children want to download an app onto their mobile phone, a request pops up on their parent's mobile phone, which the father or mother must approve. Parents should discuss all these rules and measures with their children before handing over the mobile phone and, ideally, put them in writing. For example, www.medien-kindersicher.de provides a good template for a media usage agreement.

I took a look at this template and, to be honest, it overwhelmed me. It amounts to a set of rules about eight pages long. Who is supposed to remember all that?

These rules don't have to be recited like the Ten Commandments in everyday life . The important thing is that parents and children discuss the issue together and establish rules. This also places an obligation on parents. Children want to know where they stand, and they are more likely to accept rules if they see that their parents also follow them. It is also important to assess where your child is at. What do they know and what have they already seen? It is best to set aside a whole weekend for this.

This requires a lot of commitment from parents.

It will pay off. Children also decide whether or not to approach their parents with questions or concerns based on their parents' media literacy. Most of the children in the workshops tell me that they don't talk to their parents because they have no idea. They can't join in the conversation. That's pretty sad, isn't it?

What do you say to a single mother who has no partner with whom she can discuss terms of use for a weekend?

Even single mothers can set media usage times for their 9-year-olds. And they can appeal to their teenagers not to look at sensitive content on their mobile phones in front of their younger siblings. Once again: there have always been dangerous situations for children and young people, and young people like to do things that adults disapprove of when they are not being watched. That's all fine. But the internet has a different dimension, and the dangers are many times greater. Anyone who says, «Yes, there are bad things like cyberbullying, hardcore pornography and horror films, but that doesn't affect my child,» is being negligent.

In your book «Allein mit dem Handy» (Alone with a mobile phone), you devote an entire chapter to the question of how to make WhatsApp safer for children. How does that work?

Go to the WhatsApp privacy settings and proceed step by step: Do you really want all users around the world to be able to find out when your child last used WhatsApp and whether they are currently online? By ticking two boxes, you can reduce the potential audience from over two billion WhatsApp users to only those people your child has saved as contacts.

Younger children should only be allowed to watch YouTube in the living room – and under no circumstances in their bedroom behind closed doors.

If you want to be even more secure, you can also select «no one». Then continue with your profile picture, info line, read receipts and so on. Because WhatsApp is often the first app installed on children's smartphones – and is one of the most widely used apps – I have used it as an example to explore the topic of security settings in more detail. However, you can and should also make all other social media apps safer for your children.

Do you have another example?

YouTube offers the option to disable the autoplay function so that your child does not get stuck in an endless video loop. Agree with your child on a maximum number of apps that can be installed without having to delete another app.

Something that would also be good for adults.

Definitely. But don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of technology myself and I play games with my youngest son so that I can join in the conversation. I recommend this to all parents: show interest and ask questions. Watch your son or daughter's favourite videos with them. Your child is the expert and will feel that you are paying attention. This also builds trust.

What if I suspect that something is not going well? Can I read the class chat, for example?

Of course you can, especially if it's via WhatsApp and your child is not yet 13 years old, which is the official minimum age for WhatsApp (according to the terms of use). It would be best to discuss this with your child before you even give them their mobile phone or allow them to use WhatsApp: «We'll read the class chat together.»

I also think it's a good rule that younger children should only watch YouTube in the living room – and never in their bedroom behind closed doors. That way, parents can immediately see if their child comes across something that isn't suitable for their age.

But for younger children, there is YouTube Kids, which is a better option

Ask your child if they have ever heard of «YouTube poop» or «Maya the Bee hoaxes.» There are so-called trolls on the Internet who deliberately insert jump scares, i.e. scary scenes, into children's videos and then re-upload them to YouTube. Unfortunately, Google refuses to hire people to screen videos for YouTube Kids; this is done by algorithms. And they make mistakes. Unfortunately, there is no truly effective protection for young people on the internet. And certainly no effective protection for children.

When parents ask their children how long they have been playing, they have already lost.

In many families, media usage times are a major issue – one that regularly leads to arguments. Why is this so difficult?

At this point, we can see how powerful the pull of digital media is and how addictive it can be. I am a big advocate of time limits and firmly believe that we need to show our children that we are capable of establishing rules. I often have parents come to me and say, «Mr Wolff, I tell my son all the time to stop gaming, but he won't listen. What should I do?»

You have to learn to assert yourself! When parents ask their children how long they have been playing, they have already lost. Because by doing so, they have admitted that they did not notice when their children started using media. The child will always automatically say, «Five minutes!» – regardless of how long they have actually been playing, because that is the longest playing time. And we have to learn that this answer is not due to bad character: children are children – we would have done the same.

However, parents cannot be there for every situation. Suppose your child is not allowed to take their mobile phone to bed, but is staying overnight at a friend's house where different rules apply.

I would talk to the parents – preferably before their daughter stays there. Of course, you should strike a friendly tone and not come across as patronising. But in my experience, many parents are very happy when you want to establish rules together with them. And we have to make this effort if we want to avoid unpleasant surprises.

We have a ban on smoking and alcohol for children under the age of 14. So why don't we protect them online?

At the end of last year, Australia banned social media for under-16s. Is this the right approach?

I'm afraid we have no choice but to take drastic measures. The demand for teaching skills has been around for decades, as has the demand for protecting young people. But none of this has had any significant effect on children as a whole. Instead, many children today are worse off on the internet than ever before.

Of course, there will be major problems in implementing the Australian law; children and young people will certainly try to circumvent it. But I think we still need both: guided skills training and clear regulation of the social media industry.

We have a ban on smoking and alcohol for children under the age of 14, and no one would question that. So why don't we protect children online? At some point, we will no longer be able to set time limits for children or regulate their access to the internet. Once they reach a certain age, they will no longer allow us to do so. But until then, we must protect them and hope that some of our efforts bear fruit and that they learn to use smartphones in a reasonably healthy way.